[twinzplus3]

I wish someone would send me a pm telling me how to start a thread Having read twinz post about having a gifted child (hard work) My question ,or new thread would be, 'How do you determine whether a child is 'gifted'? and what is the criteria?I seem to come from a family who in this generation particularly, (the ones born within the past 20 odd years)have produced many very gifted children,but are they?Hmmm! Any proper definition available?

Just starting the new thread. . .I'll answer in a little bit!

[deedee1231]

I was told my son was "gifted" at the conclusion of a 2 day long dr appt. I took him for a full evaluation at the insistence of his school (before we began homeschooling) because they would not take my word for it that he had high functioning autism. They wanted an official diagnosis. Part of the eval was an I.Q. test and he scored very high on it (very superior range), which was pretty amazing given everything else that was going on with him at the time, !

Well, I do think my son is gifted because I know that his capacity for learning (and understanding) is higher than average. I do, however hesitate to "label" him as "gifted" because he has a lot of challenges other kids don't have to deal with and most days I am happy if he just seems average to any random observer.

And to answer your question about a proper definition, I guess I don't really have one, but I think that the word "gifted" is really thrown around a lot these days. It kind of makes me wonder, are we going to have a larger number of gifted children, or will the average shift such that kids who are now considered gifted will be average and the standard for gifted will become harder to reach?

[twinzplus3]

ARGH I just almost finished a long answer to your question and then hit a button and boom it's gone.

Well, I think you NEVER ask the parents--we all think our kids are brilliantly gifted. I think there aren't any hard and fast answers. I mean how do you decide that a child is gifted vs just has pushy parents or even parents who provided good opportunities? I know one of my great frustrations in trying to find resources for homeschooling my son is shifting through the myriad of resources and/or people that don't get it bc they really don't seem to understand what it is to have a profoundly gifted child all the while mixing 'bright' in with slightly gifted in with profoundly gifted. (These labels are on a scale. . .not my labels.)

I think that my general answer would be a child who functions several grade levels ahead of where he should be, could be considered 'gifted'. But again that definition has some flaws.

For us, it was our pediatrician that suggested that our son as well as another one of our daughters was gifted. We've since had this confirmed for our son by a few "experts" although we've never had him tested thus far. The daughter is very young still--I'm not sure what we'll do or how we'll handle her yet.

It's not a label I'm entirely comfortable with honestly. . .but have learned that it is helpful on occassions.

[songbirdxx]

I am still not sure what makes a child gifted.I suppose if a child is extremely high achieving, by nature!without pushy parents, or special circumstances,infact the parents wish they would give it a rest sometimes, as they are the exhausted ones!yet still the child and teen perform way above everyone not only in their school, but in their town, or even country, in everything ,including music,sport,art, academics all subjects,drama and everything they seem to put their mind too. This in my eyes would make the child and teen seem gifted.I do know children and teens like this ,where they are extremely high achieving academically, but also have an apparent genius at sport or music or drama! and even all three!Far from being pushy the parents recognise a depression sets in if the child,teen etc is not doing all these things they have a genuine desire to do!Interesting! Gifted?Perhaps! I am still not sure though!
What is profoundly gifted?

[twinzplus3]

See the problem with that definition though is it then leaves out kids like deedee's son who has high functioning autism and is considered gifted. I think typically for educational purposes gifted is defined by a certain IQ number. But then again there are problems with that definition as well. That's why I tend to look at it as functioning several grade levels ahead.

Profoundly gifted is just the label that is associated with a higher number on an IQ test. (It goes from 'gifted' to 'highly gifted' to 'profoundly gifted'--and even there, there's some variance.) It generally means that the children have profoundly advanced abilities--noticeable to all who come in contact with the child.

I will admit, one of my great frustrations in trying to find resources for my son in particular, is that there is a real vagueness to the definition. So for example, when I asked a certain forum where I could find math curriculum for gifted kids. . .I got all sorts of interesting answers that indicated to me among other things that there was a lack of understanding of what I meant by 'gifted'.

[songbirdxx]

Thanks Twinz!
I think my personal definition is now, 'A gifted child is any child who has an ability, or even an apparent genius in something for their age, which can make them appear odd or different within their peer group' Just a thought! Oh I will admit I am and was that exhausted mother who has two young adult children now,still the same,especially the oldest! They still exhaust me,but I wouldn't change them for the world Dh agrees. Infact they take after him so it's tripple trouble here!

[twinzplus3]

That's a pretty good definition I think! It's definitely a good question that leaves a lot to be discussed.

I think then the next question is whether or not it really needs to be identified. I used to say definitively not. . .but as I look for resources for my son, I find that sometimes having that label is helpful. It is definitely helpful with the boe in homeschoolng. My dd is musically inclined. . .plays piano by ear. So I think she'll be in a different 'category' of giftedness where her resources will be made available based on auditions and/or interviews.

Can you tell I'm pretty fascinated by educational issues?

[songbirdxx]

I am too,I have had to be. My second son plays guitar and piano (composes his own tunes by ear) and has never had a music lesson in his life! It freaks us out.First son plays clarinet and violin and has gone through all the grades in the latter.He plays with or without music! Actually now looking back I wonder how I got through it all! I did love my child rearing days, even when at times it was very hard. Make the most of it,time flies.Having said that,I am still at it, having been to 4 productions of the uni musical last week,final night being last night. My two sons attend the same uni and both had lead roles! Phew!!! Dh and I were involved in the recording.

[deedee1231]

Do I think it needs to be identified? Well, I think it depends on the child. For example I have a neice who is considered gifted and has been stuck with that label since kindergarten. She always excelled in grade school and even middle school but has really struggled with high school. Now her mother and teachers are at a loss as to what to do with her because she is falling behind--but she is "gifted." Is she just not being challenged enough? Is she just bored? Has she become lazy? Is she suddenly more concerned with being cool than making good grades? If she had never been identified as gifted in the first place, I doubt there would be so much focus on "why" and more conversation on "what should we do about it" which by far the more important question, IMO.


Then there is my son. He was diagnosed PDD-NOS at age 2. After conducting my own extensive research and spending hours a day using techniques designed to teach autistic children to communicate, I had a pretty good idea that he was autistic. But he was so smart! Was he a savant? No, I didn't really think so. Did he have Aspergers? That didn't seem to fit either. But did it matter if he was learning? And he was learning-- and more than just to speak--he was learning math and reading and he wasn't even old enough to start kindergarten yet. He was also doing odd things for his age, like 500 piece puzzles and super sudoku.

When he started kindergarten, his teachers knew that he was different. They were so insistant that it was behavior related. He was just doing too well in school to be autistic, and they didn't think he was...until I brought them a diagnosis to prove it! In the long run, it didn't make much difference in his public school education. They don't know what to do with special needs children who are also gifted. They want to put them into special needs class rooms and ignore the gifted part. Or put them in gifted class rooms and treat the special needs part like disruptive behavior. It can be more than frustrating for a parent to deal with.

But I have to say that I am glad I know. It helps me to keep him on track and I am not tempted to say, "Oh well, he is autistic so I guess that is the best he can do" when it comes to subjects he doesn't really like, such as writing. I know what he is capable of academically and I try to keep him challenged. I think that is good for him.

[twinzplus3]

So "gifted" dd that plays piano by ear is 2 years old now. . .she'll be 3 in June and what you're telling me is I have about 20-22 years more of rehearsals?

What do they do with gifted kids in schools there? (I'm assuming you didn't homeschool--right?) Do they have gifted and talented programs?