[RebekahT]

I'm afraid this is very long, it just all seems so complicated, I don't know how to say it simpler.

I met my husband online. We were both computer programmers, he in England, me in the Midwest, USA. He is a recluse, and I like crowds and people and family. But he is also very open, very honest, and a strong negotiator (with regards to everything.), and I'm learning these qualities from him. I moved to England and we worked together on our own businesses. We got married a couple of years later - 3 1/2 years ago.

He has been gambling for 13 years at least. He is very good at keeping in control of his money but he has a problem controlling himself with regards to how much time he spends at it and letting it get in the way of how well he takes care of his own bodily needs (sleep/hygene/eating). I have always found this very irritating. But it comes in spurts. He has had a few extended spells where he doesn't gamble, but he's not particularly happy, and he's always got some sort of obsessive pursuit (message boards, etc.) which he seems to like to escape into (he says he's not escaping).

Working with my husband from home since we got together in 2001 I have allowed myself (not realizing it all at once) to become dependent upon him to meet my social needs as well as financial ones. He, not being a social person, has more than he needs of me lol. We got along ok (I should have gone out and gotten a job a lot sooner to solve my co-dependency issues, but we had love and attraction) up until 2005 when we moved to the US. Within 2 weeks I became pregnant with our daughter. It was an ok pregnancy to begin with, but he was very uninvolved with the whole thing. I had to go on bedrest at 5 months for the remainder, and it was hard on us both. It was very hard for me to rebuild my social network. It was also very hard to ask him for help, and when I did it was very hard for him to give it. And I'm afraid before we had our daughter I was already feeling some resentment over his disinterest in what I felt was the biggest most life-changing event either of us would face.

I didn't make a big deal out of it, but I felt it. When our daughter was born, he was still glued to his computer screen (he didn't play poker at all her first year, instead he obsessed on online forums) and resented me asking him to look after our daughter for a bit while I go to the bathroom, etc. and I was so completely overwhelmed not feeling like I could ask him for any help that I started having panic attacks when she was 3 months old because of lack of sleep and no time to myself. We muddled through, he took on some night feedings. He claimed that he had different ideas about gender roles (coming from a very traditional stay-at-home-mom-and-working-dad type family) though I made it clear to him before we decided to have kids that I envisioned closer to 50/50 on the parenting responsibilities.

Since we got together there have been issues concerning a financial inequality (he has assets, I do not) which I think he feels entitle him to a little more freedom with regard to how he spends his time and money, though he says he doesn't really want me to go and get a job because he would miss me. But the time I spend working, and all of our expenses are accounted for, and I've been building up a debt to him. (I really feel like this is a major problem between us, and growing.) I have been taking care of our daughter, the house, the lawn, the car, whatever cooking gets done, and I call the plumber when we need one. He takes out the trash, pays the bills, does the taxes. Basically, I feel like my daughter and I are the family while my husband stays aloof. But like his poker playing, his involvement in our family fluctuates.

What's different since we had our daughter? I have a lot less time to myself, taking care of her needs in addition to household duties, feel unable to pursue my own interests because of financial issues. She goes to daycare, but even evenings and weekends account for more than a full-time job! And he tries to maintain the kind of lifestyle he had before we were parents. He openly resists what he says is me trying to change him. Yes, I feel like there has to be a change, but it's a part of becoming a parent, and I guess I just expected him to adjust. I tried so hard not asking him for help, and not asking him to change, but I couldn't wait any longer. I resent him for having such a hard first year with our daughter, and he resents me for trying to change him. He's sad really, because he feels like he can't be what I want him to be. He claims that if I didn't try so hard to get him to help, that he would do it on his own, but I don't believe that. I've already tried that.

When it comes time for me to ask him to look after our daughter for a bit in the evening once a week (We send her to daycare so I can get a break during the day, and it was like pulling teeth to get him to agree to that.) or when she's sick and staying home, which he agreed to, he says he doesn't feel that it's fair considering he's the one bringing in the money. I've told him that I'm more than willing to take on more of the financial burden. I've never felt that I could be a stay at home mom, though I spent our daughter's first year trying as hard as I could to fit into this role.

I want to have a close family. I'm so envious of other women with involved husbands. I want to feel like my husband and I are a team instead of at constant odds over parenting and financial responsibilities.So I've decided to go to work. This way my husband will not be able to use money as an excuse any longer and I can get more of the social interaction I crave, so maybe we'll be more in balance with how much time we want to spend with one another. Lately things have been so stressed, I also think it'll be good just in case we need to separate, because I need to feel like I can be independent again financially.

About a year ago I was still telling myself that he was having a hard time having moved to a new country and immediately becoming a dad - it was just too much for him. Now I just feel like he just wants to be single again without the responsibilities. I can't deny I've lost respect for him, and that's really deteriorated our relationship. We seldom have sex, and when he was initiating it (up until a month or so ago) I felt like "whoa, too fast" because I feel like there's no intimacy or closeness anymore. He admits to feeling depressed and even having suicidal thoughts (though he assures me he'd never do anything like that). I don't see much hope of him going to get help, though because he's so cynical about the healthcare system and over-medication (and worried about side-effects) and a tightwad (and we don't have good ***********... sheesh he's just a ball of worries.

I know we need counselling, we've talked about our problems extensively, and he agreed we may need counselling, but he decided to try out my solution of getting a job first (because he didn't want to waste the money when he felt like we'd already figured out what the problem was). But I feel like I'm already in the first stages of building a life without him. He really just can't face taking on the responsibility of looking after our daughter and resents me putting any more jobs on his plate by asking him (because he feels it's my job). Though when he's with her he's very attentive at teaching her things (but he is such a perfectionist, he's stressed me out for two years now with details and worrying about whether she's getting the best care/nutrition/what-have-you.).

So the part of me that doesn't feel like I have my hand on the doorknob feels like when I have a job and I'm pulling my own weight financially and he's accepted that he's doing more like 50/50 (including housework - he knows that's the plan) and we're still having issues, then he'll address some of his issues (like the gambling, and obsessive-compulsive behavior, and depression, and anxiety).

I just feel so sad for us. We've really been struggling with this for so long. Last week we had an "Ah ha" moment when we realized that he'd been resisting demanding me to go to work and I'd been resisting demanding him to take on more childcare duties when it's what we've needed all along.

But even now that he knows he needs to sort out his sleeping (up all night, sleeping half the day, short on sleep), etc. he really just drags his feet doing what he needs to about it. We seldom go to bed at the same time or have any cuddle time. I just honestly feel like he doesn't care about me anymore. Last night he stayed up too late to look after her this morning as he had agreed to. He said he just forgot. He was playing poker, he knows he's been out of control lately, he admits it. I feel so disappointed and hurt. I feel like we can't wait till I get a job and see if that works before we go to counselling. At times I feel like the problem is his gambling, and how much I hate his gambling, and I feel guilty because I married him even though I hated his gambling, so how can I ask him to change that now? And that makes me feel hopeless.

Any words of advice? Any hope? I really love him, though all the hurt and resentment are there, I want to work through it, but I can't do it all myself. He says he loves me and says he wants to spend the rest of his life with me. But while he feels like he's making major concessions (like getting daycare, agreeing to look after occasionally - which he still complains is unfair when I arrange with him for it), I feel like he's not making any of the right gestures - the ones that will really let me know he cares. Is there anything else maybe I'm just not seeing?

RebekahT

[mcmama]

I'm glad you recognize your codependency issues - those are what you can change, and will enable you to make the right decisions for your life.

You can't change him, he has to change himself.

Also, any man who feels that hiring daycare and sharing in child care responsibilities are major concessions even when everything is arranged for him is not really sharing. This is a passive aggressive no win game for you. Either he can't do it because you didn't set it up right, or he can;'t do it because you won't let go of the control. My ex husband's way of playing this game was to sweetly peer at me in our counseling sessions and say "I just want to help you. But you've gotta draw me a diagram". And of course, since I don't know how to do that, his inaction was my fault. This is a technique of emotional abuse.

Your husband has an addiction, and he needs to acknowledge it. There are gamblers anonymous organizations which can help, but you can't do it for him.

Hugs to you. HOlidays always bring this out worse than ever.

[JeanLynn81]

Wow. All I have to say is be careful what you wish for.

I am a single mom who has my daughter ALL THE TIME. When she is in daycare...I would kill to have free time, but you know what I have to do? Yeah...go to work and school. Which probably adds up to about 45 hours a week total. The rest of the time is me and my daughter. I don't get an evening off, or a night out. EVER.

But I'm not even angry about this, because I love my daughter and I don't mind spending time with her. I've learned to adjust.

I think you need to step back and take a look at who you're really resentful towards. Did you ever get help for post-partum depression? Sounds like you had it bad, and haven't gotten over it. I don't know a single mom who resents the time they have to spend with their kids this much. Something is seriously wrong.

Not to say your husband doesn't need help either...if anything for his gambling addiction. But really, how many hours a week does he work?

Oh and let me see if I got this right-did you really say your husband has to stay home from work to help care for the child when she is sick? I really hope I didn't read that right. If he's the only one working, why can't you stay home and take care of her?

I'm sorry for my blunt honesty, but I just can't believe half of the things I just read...

[MissyChrissy]

Originally Posted by mcmama

I'm glad you recognize your codependency issues - those are what you can change, and will enable you to make the right decisions for your life.

You can't change him, he has to change himself.

Also, any man who feels that hiring daycare and sharing in child care responsibilities are major concessions even when everything is arranged for him is not really sharing. This is a passive aggressive no win game for you. Either he can't do it because you didn't set it up right, or he can;'t do it because you won't let go of the control. My ex husband's way of playing this game was to sweetly peer at me in our counseling sessions and say "I just want to help you. But you've gotta draw me a diagram". And of course, since I don't know how to do that, his inaction was my fault. This is a technique of emotional abuse.

Your husband has an addiction, and he needs to acknowledge it. There are gamblers anonymous organizations which can help, but you can't do it for him.

Hugs to you. HOlidays always bring this out worse than ever.

I agree with everything she just said.

My suggestion is to work on what you can change-yourself. Get counseling. If you want a job, get one. Stop being dependent on him for anything. If he doesn't come around, it sounds like you're going to leave him eventually...and that's not necessarily a bad thing. I do think he needs to be more involved, or leave. But you can't "make" him be that.

Good luck to you-it's isn't going to be easy, but I do believe once you get yourself in supportive therapy, get a job of your own with your own money, and start making some friends outside the home, you'll feel much, much better.

[RebekahT]

Originally Posted by JeanLynn81

Wow. All I have to say is be careful what you wish for.

I am a single mom who has my daughter ALL THE TIME. When she is in daycare...I would kill to have free time, but you know what I have to do? Yeah...go to work and school. Which probably adds up to about 45 hours a week total. The rest of the time is me and my daughter. I don't get an evening off, or a night out. EVER.

But I'm not even angry about this, because I love my daughter and I don't mind spending time with her. I've learned to adjust.

I think you need to step back and take a look at who you're really resentful towards. Did you ever get help for post-partum depression? Sounds like you had it bad, and haven't gotten over it. I don't know a single mom who resents the time they have to spend with their kids this much. Something is seriously wrong.

Not to say your husband doesn't need help either...if anything for his gambling addiction. But really, how many hours a week does he work?

Oh and let me see if I got this right-did you really say your husband has to stay home from work to help care for the child when she is sick? I really hope I didn't read that right. If he's the only one working, why can't you stay home and take care of her?

I'm sorry for my blunt honesty, but I just can't believe half of the things I just read...

I'm afraid you missed where I said we've both worked from home since I met him in 2001. We actually sold our business in 2006, so we're not working on it anymore. He manages his investments (keeps an eye on his stocks and makes a few trades here and there); otherwise, he does not work, except for his "chores" of paying the bills, dealing with the accountant to sort out our taxes and puts out the trash. But he says he's playing poker to bring money in. That's his justification. Over the year he's making a bit, but nowhere like a wage for all the time he spends. He really only does it because he likes to. So you see, you misunderstood me.

As for looking after her when she's sick, I don't ask him to look after her every time she's sick, only to give me a relief for a couple of hours, and he's complained that he doesn't feel it's fair (because of the reasons above, money, etc.) whenever I ask him for it.

What you don't understand is I'm not resentful of the time I spend with my daughter, and I can guarantee I love her as much as you love yours. I'm resentful of the lack of help and support I've gotten from my husband. Because we made our daughter together, with the understanding that we would both be responsible for her, and he hasn't accepted his responsibility with her. It sounds as though you think I should be happy for a spouse at all, whether he's supportive or not, and I disagree with you completely. I need a real partner. I think I have every right to expect him to be a partner to me.

We put our daughter in daycare because my husband didn't want to take care of her at all (At least not with any responsibilities attached. He wanted to breeze in and out whenever he had the inclination.). I'm naturally a very goal oriented, need to have my own projects underway kind of person. That's what I need to have a sense of fulfillment. I needed some space to figure out what to do with my life (And everybody needs space, yourself included. It sounds like you're envious of me having some space, and not completely free of resentment yourself.)

I knew I couldn't be a stay at home mom even before we got married. When we had our daughter I tried as hard as I could to do it because he wouldn't help me without a fight, and he wouldn't get child care for her at all the first year, but I couldn't make myself be happy having no space for myself, no time off. I wished dearly that I could be like other stay at home moms, happy for it. My husband finally agreed to put her in daycare, because when she was 9 months old and went to visit his family in Wales, even his family was stressed having us around. He couldn't deny we had some issues and needed some time off, and together. So we put her in daycare part time 3 - 4 hours per day every day, and I got to take a shower without stressing over whether I'd wake her up from her one precious nap a day. And you know, I didn't think I would be that uptight about her before I had her... no problem getting a sitter, etc, but my husband always stressing over decisions and what was the best care for her, the best nutrition, the best way to teach her really put the pressure on me not only to be a stay at home mom but a SUPER mom. I felt like I was doing everything and I couldn't do it right, I was trying so hard to live up to his expectations and also buying in to it. I really do want the best things for her. But the fact is, I couldn't give her the best of everything and the best of myself - it just wasn't possible, I buckled.

I want to contribute financially. Having some time off, I thought I could make my own project, and start my own business, but all this business starting, etc. takes a financial investment. As you read above, I'm running up a debt to my husband (he keeps an actual record) which keeps me from feeling I can start my own business - lack of independence, confidence, room to explore, etc. and without me actually being successful at my own business I'm not contributing financially, and without contributing financially, he feels it's unfair to take over any of the responsibilities of looking after our daughter.

You're not the first person to act as though I'm unjustified in my discontent. My husband has told me himself how lucky I should feel being able to stay home without having to go and get a job, to have time to myself, because lots of mom's don't even have a partner to help make a living and have to work full time and take care of the kid full time too. And I could accept that responsibility, if that was my situation. But you know, I'm not a single mom. I have a partner. Or I thought I did. The fact is, the first year of Sophie's life, I didn't have any time to myself, and I would look over at my husband, sleeping in (having gotten little sleep myself), or pottering away at the computer, and heck yeah, I felt envious and resentful. Wouldn't anyone? I don't think it's fair to say I should compare my life to how rotten it could be and feel grateful, I have the same right as anyone to see that my own needs are met and feel that I'm having personal growth as well.

To be fair, he has apologized for not helping me out more in the first year. He says he was really depressed and just had such a hard time coming to grips with it. I think he still does, though he's improved a great deal. I suspect he can't face the responsibility because he wants to do things with precision and perfection, and it's not possible with a kid, and he feels anxiety from that, so he doesn't accept the job. But there ought to come a point where he just learns to accept it, and he hasn't.

RebekahT

[RebekahT]

Originally Posted by mcmama

I'm glad you recognize your codependency issues - those are what you can change, and will enable you to make the right decisions for your life.

You can't change him, he has to change himself.

Also, any man who feels that hiring daycare and sharing in child care responsibilities are major concessions even when everything is arranged for him is not really sharing. This is a passive aggressive no win game for you. Either he can't do it because you didn't set it up right, or he can;'t do it because you won't let go of the control. My ex husband's way of playing this game was to sweetly peer at me in our counseling sessions and say "I just want to help you. But you've gotta draw me a diagram". And of course, since I don't know how to do that, his inaction was my fault. This is a technique of emotional abuse.

Your husband has an addiction, and he needs to acknowledge it. There are gamblers anonymous organizations which can help, but you can't do it for him.

Hugs to you. HOlidays always bring this out worse than ever.

Thanks for your post. I'm not sure I understand you correctly when you mention emotional abuse. Let me understand this. He had a hard time agreeing to getting daycare both because of the cost of it and not wanting to trust others with our daughter. And he also has a hard time looking after her himself when I ask him to do it - he gets instantly depressed and/or an argument erupts, and usually it's such an ordeal that I don't ask as often as he's agreed to help. He says that getting daycare and agreeing to help me out are examples of how much he cares because facing them has been so hard. He says they're major concessions, I think mostly because he feels like it's more fair financially for me to be doing all the baby care myself. You're saying that this is emotional abuse? You think this is passive/aggressive behavior?

RebekahT

[mcmama]

Even if you were doing all the baby care yourself, he would still be pitching in. Mothers are not indestructable.

If you are home but are completely isolated with no backup or support, this is no good. Many of the parents who brought their children to me for daycare (I was a family child care provider) were either working at home or working part time. They needed to keep their skills current, or their businesses from going down the tubes. One ran a desktop publishing business from her home with her husband. Another was an artist, and another a musician. You need kid free time to keep this up. Economically, for these families, the payoff was later.

Having an argument erupt when you ask his assistance in the 24/7 business of parenting and child care, but being forced to consider paid child care a major concession is very manipulative. It sounds like passive aggressive behavior which is controlling and limiting. That is abusive.

Not saying you should do what you what whenever you want - but there should be a partnership here. As a child care provider when I heard the words "I just don't trust anyone to take care of the child except her mother" coming from the dad or the grandparents, there were often control issues in the family.

Choosing child care is also a partnership. It is very awkward for a child care provider to have communication primarily with one parent, because sooner or later you need to reach out to both - and just a routine call can blow things up out of proportion. This is not good for anyone.